37 thoughts on “battle cry invades san fran again”

  1. Marko what is it about that article that makes your heart heavy? The cities response? Or the BattleCry events?

  2. According to this article it seems that any Christian group meeting in San Fransisco that believes homosexuality is sinful would receive the same response. I’m not sure “love the sinner, hate the sin” would get past the sentiment. It sure would help I would think.

    I don’t think everyone would be satisfied until Ron and his group said that homosexuality is ok.

  3. i expect cities to act like cities: in particular, cities like san fran to act like san fran. that’s not to say their response is great. it’s just what i expect. i would LIKE to expect, on the other hand, that christians would be more concerned with showing the love of jesus to the world than with claiming our rights. do you really think you’d find jesus approaching a city like san francisco by holding protests and news conferences at its main gate to condemn the people of the city? and after creating such anger a year ago, to go back and do the same again is clearly communicating to all san franciscans, “we care much more about ourselves than we do about you.” THAT’S the heavy heart and the deep sigh.

  4. Very interesting Marko…very interesting.

    I can understand the concern…and you know maybe we should teach teens to not be as bold in their faith. To not assembly and pray in a quiet way as to show the love of Jesus by not fighting back. To not go forward in the face of adversity. To back down in the face of intolerance to christians because it might offend someone.

    I’ll agree that Jesus main “fight” was with the established religious right wing more than anything.

    But as far as I can see and from what I read in the article you supplied was that the gay community was openly hostile towards the teens. There was no mention of teen mania holding protests “against” gays. The reality is that the vast majority of the gay population are not going to be changed even if they “see” the love of God in Christians. Most are established in their beliefs and don’t want that type of change. Will there be some, yes, maybe, I hope and pray.

    To say that teens in the San Francisco area don’t have a right to assembly for a conference of this type to inspire them to get closer to God is kind of “weird”. As progressive as San Francisco says it is there seems to be as much intolerance in them as they say are in Christians.

    I think that no matter what type of christian teen organization came in and no matter the manner in which they came. To gather in that size is a threat to what San Franciscan’s believe.

    I would really love to hear your ideas on how you could inspire teens in that area to go all out for God without incurring the so called wrath that teenmania has in trying. I would love to hear about some of the things youth specialties is doing to make a difference in that area. Can it be done in mass as teenmania is trying to do without facing the same challenge.

    Ron is right they do not face this same challenge across America. Can it be done in any other manner in San Francisco? Or should we just leave a generation there and count it as a loss.

    Making Difference Makers

  5. what can’t this be a battle cry for radical love, to have kids find out how to liveCHRIST by getting involved in ministry instead of a rally.

    too bad it’s not 20,000 students heading to hospice houses for aids patients, soup kitchens, shelters for battered and abused women and children. there is much more impact there than the kind ron luce talked about in his article. 20,000 students prepared to love and liveCHRIST would make an overwhelming difference.

    this battle cry just seems like a slicker version of the “God hates fags” group. while i think homosexuality is a sin it doesn’t mean as Christ followers that we are called to hurt and separate them even further. it would be so much better for our world if every Christian was the visible love of Christ instead of just talking about the love or Christ or what is goes wrong.

    it would be a blessing if the students were praying “for” and not “against”…

    …for the ability to love despite differences.

    …for the chance to care for those who don’t agree with our biblical world view.

    …for the eyes to see that God calls us to him despite being sinful and will clean us up according to his plan and purpose.

    …for the chance to influence a town based on joy, peace, compassion and love.

    …for the leaders of the town to come to know Christ.

  6. ok — this is dialogue. i\’m not trying to whack anyone on the head. but…

    erik: i\’m sure there are PLENTY of christian groups who meet in san francisco who believe that homosexuality is a lifestyle the Bible speaks against, who are still involved in real ministry with real people, bringing the love of Christ rather than an agenda.

    jason: this sarcastic paragraph of yours is completely ludicrous…
    I can understand the concern…and you know maybe we should teach teens to not be as bold in their faith.
    dude, no one is saying we should teach teens to be bold in their faith. but jesus clearly teaches us (come on! this is SO clearly the teaching of the Bible!) that to be bold in our faith is to take care of the widows and the ophrans, to feed the poor, to visit those in prison. show me a place in scripture where jesus says that being bold in our faith means standing up to the powers that be, or claiming our \”rights\”.

    To not assembly and pray in a quiet way as to show the love of Jesus by not fighting back.
    um, to assemble and pray in a quiet way as to show the love of Jesus is NOT assembling on the stairs of the SF city hall! assembling on the stairs of the SF city hall is proclaiming, \”we\’re at war!\” did you see the footage from the last time?

    To not go forward in the face of adversity.
    jason, please. this is absurd. i want my teens to be PASSIONATE about going forward in the face of adversity, which does not mean to protest in the face of those with a different set of sins in their life! going forward in the face of adversity is about teenagers who have an actualized faith, and live that out day to day, in how they treat their parents, how the treat others at school, how they treat racial minorities, and how they respond to the outcast within their own youth group. THAT\’S counter-cultural jesus stuff, man. not standing on city hall steps to tell people how wrong they are.

    To back down in the face of intolerance to christians because it might offend someone.
    i agree, the intollerance of christians is really annoying. but this is where — i believe — we give the students, and the leaders, a real opportunity to do all the things you have listed above: the fact that they ARE being treated unfairly is their opportunity to experience Jesus! remember blessed are the meek, and the first shall be last, and all that? i challenge you to show me a time when Jesus was treated unfairly that his primary concern was standing up for himself.

    ty: yes.

  7. Ok, I think I missed the part where they are standing on city hall stairs. I didn’t see any video footage. But thanks Marko for the clarification. I know you don’t like war metaphor, I was trying to figure out if you were against the event or against the way it was coming off in the community of San Fransisco (I’m thinking you are more against the latter).

    I think that what Teen Mania is doing is drawing more attention than the average Christian group because they are being public about it, I guess if they are targeting gays publicly like this that isn’t the most productive thing. I think they would have a greater impact doing some sort of servant evangelism in the community as opposed to …er…being opposed to San Fransisco.

    *sigh*

  8. Marko, thanks for your heavy heart. As a youth pastor who has served in the SF Bay Area for 22 years I have had a hard time with Battle Cry coming to town. I minister on the peninsula of San Francisco and it’s one of the darkest places to do ministry. I become frustrated with organizations like Acquire the Fire who come into an area and don’t know the culture or want to take the time to know the culture. Obviously Ron as a passion for youth but the damage that is done because of judgment in the name of rallies hurts those of us who are evangelicals ministering in the area. Yet again, the media portrays a bunch of “whacked out evangelicals,” the Bay Area buys it and becomes even more suspicious of Christians and Christ and peoples hearts become more hardened. I’ve been watching the footage this weekend since I refuse to take our students to Battle Cry. What’s interesting to me is that all the inerviews that were shown on our TV stations we NOT people from the Bay Area! We have students who are passionate about Jesus and are bold in their faith without having to cause a war of words. Many of them suffer for it. I want to teach our students a real love for Christ and what it means to serve Him in the culure they live in. I want to teach students the Word of God so they know how to respond in love to the culture they live in. Let’s teach students what it means to live out the Biblical Gospel in the culture they live in, instead of teaching them to be afraid of it.

  9. makes me think of this…
    “if i speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or clanging cymbal…..”.We cannot minister to ANYONE effectively without love. I don’t see any here.

  10. As I write a response I am weighing my words cautiously. I think that somewhere we have lost the meaning of following Christ. I hear both sides of the argument and I’m torn in two because I can really see where both sides are coming from. I have done a lot of reading over the last year (and continue to do so) about what people are saying the future of the church is. Part of what I am reading really resonates with me and part of it I’m not real sold on yet.

    I think part of the thing that bothers me most is that part of me is hearing “lets accept everyone for who they are” and I might be adding to that statement (a bit cynically) “but lets not confront them on their sin.” I don’t think that’s the intention or the implication. And I think that was my knee-jerk reaction here. Marko (please correct me if I am totally off base here) but I don’t think you are saying lets accept people for who they are and NOT encourage to turn from their sin (in this instance homosexuality) but to not “condemn” them and coming across as jerks. Not to celebrate their lifestyle but to befriend them and use more of a “relational” style of ministry with them. this completely resonates with me and I know it works well. Again I might be way off base and if I am please correct me.

    I am also hearing “we need to empower our teens to stand against culture and be bold in our faith” which I agree with. But I think at the same time we have to learn how to live in the culture and not be of it…not creating ANOTHER Christian sub-culture within our culture because the church has already done that successfully. I know I’m not making friends here but that’s alright.

    I also realize that we are sinners saved by grace and we have to extend that grace and mercy but yet at the same time be seekers of justice….so what I see here is the struggle to find the balance. Maybe I’m totally naive and way off base here…which is definitely possible.

    So my question is, “is there a balance and if so what is the balance?” I see both sides as valid and sometimes needed. Jesus used tough love with the money changers so where does tough love come into play with sinners in general? And if tough love is to play a role then how do we effectively implement it without turning people away? I think the problem is sometimes we come across as overly zealous tyrants and we lack on the showing grace and mercy while displaying tough love at the same time. But I think maybe sometimes we also come across as being extremely tolerant without really meaning to be. Like I said at the beginning of my comment I am doing alot of reading trying to learn the balance so please go easy on this post.

    Being like Jesus is messy….Spirituality is messy.

  11. Jason – It seems to me that no one answered your questions because they took the time to respond to your original assumptions. They found them lacking, and therefore your questions were irrelevant.

    If you don’t like it, that is fine. I can understand how you must be hurt by hearing that people don’t even agree with your basic assumptions. But your assumptions are presumptuous, misguided, and indicative of a faith tradition in this country that has cared more about conformity to a specific image than it has ever cared about relationship. To my mind, that isn’t just a sin, but a crime.

    Ron Luce supports a gospel of hatred, disunity, and Christian elitism. It is disgusting. It seems to me that he is more concerned about “fighting battles” than he is about the thousands of kids who are unwittingly drawn into his events to pay for the privilege of spreading this gospel of hatred, and who leave thinking they have made a positive difference in that city and that they understand Jesus better.

    The only generation I am concerned about losing are the thousands of kids who will never experience an authentic relationship with Christ because of the distorted view of Christ that is presented at these events.

    That San Fransicisans are rejecting Christ because of this event is a tragedy, but thank God that they are, for it would be an even greater tragedy if they accepted Christ as presented by this conference. THAT would truly be sad.

  12. Jason,
    Your post was primarily a declaration not an inquiry. You did however end with a question:

    \”I would love to hear about some of the things youth specialties is doing to make a difference in that area. Can it be done in mass as teenmania is trying to do without facing the same challenge…Can it be done in any other manner in San Francisco? Or should we just leave a generation there and count it as a loss.\”

    Ty, Marko and shughes all gave excellent answers to your question. They suggested possibilities that would be more in line with the way of Jesus.

    Hey Marko, maybe YS could connect with shughes and arrange for groups of teens to come into SF and spend some time living the gospel in its darkest and mosts broken places. Maybe such a thing would shine like a light on a hill and cause those around to give glory to the Father.
    We could call it MercyCry or AgapeCry or maybe we just recognize it as “true religion” and invite our students to drink deeply at its well.

    just my thoughts.

  13. I was pretty unaware of the whole controversy that Marko was pointing out, so I did a little background resarch. You can go and see a video that evidently ATF made for Battle Cry last year. Granted it was made by ATF, but it kind of shows the rally that they did on the Friday before the start of last year\’s conference.
    I certainly have nothing against what ATF believes, but the way that they are presenting it is obviously confrontational, provocative, and belligerent. Ron Luce is from the Bay area (Concord) and I can appreciate his desire to influence his hometown, but there must be a better way to go about it. JM

  14. I have somewhat mixed feelings about all of this. As a youth pastor (former Bay Area, now MO)who has taken kids to ATF events and seen God really speak to them through this ministry, I am thankful for the vision of Ron and ATF. However, I completely agree with former posts of Marko’s about the “battle” imagery. To teach our kids that we are at war with our culture is not only unhealthy, it’s sacreligious. We are at war with the enemy, not the culture!

    I also think that ATF has gotten off-track of what it originally set out to do. I would put it in the same class of James Dobson and Focus on the Family. There was a time I could listen to Dobson and count on receiving Godly wisdom for my family. He is now just shy of being a whore of the Republican Party. This is the direction I see Ron going with ATF, too.

    Jeff Myers – Lebanon, MO

  15. Why if YS is against Battlecry do they continue to allow them to advertise in their publications like at the NYWC and in the CORE training books. Both had ads in them for Battlecry.

    Marko you can’t say its just your opinion and not YS’s that you disagree with Battlecry. At the CORE training on the free resources table was the article from Group magazine from last fall that condemns Battlecry. Not the whole magazine, just that article. Why does YS continue to accept money if they don’t agree with what Battlecry is doing?

    I have not been to a Battlecry event. I will be going in April. I have however read several of Ron’s books and have led a group thru the RiseUP discipleship series. They were good books and the RiseUP series finally got some of our youth fired up and actually doing instead of talking. There has also been a shift in what some of them watch and the movies they go to. They are more aware of the negative influence of the media now and are changing because of it.

  16. Concerning our responsibility towards outsiders:

    1 Peter 3
    15 But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, 16keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander.

    1 Thessalonians 4
    11 Make it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, just as we told you, 12 so that your daily life may win the respect of outsiders and so that you will not be dependent on anybody.

    Galatians 6
    1Brothers, if anyone is caught in any
    transgression, you who are spiritual should restore him in a spirit of
    gentleness
    .

  17. I think what can be so tragic is that the message of Christ can be rolled up and trotted out by opponents as being an anti-gay message. I do have greater concerns however. I have watched over the last 20 years as youth ministry has become more and more “event driven”. Our validity is the truth, not the critical mass. Events are useful tools sometimes. They have become the driving force behind so much of what people perceive Christianity to be. I won’t Lucebash. He is responsible to God to fight the battles that God wants him to fight… but someone needs to be responsible to care for the wounded and repair the potholes after many of these events.

  18. I’ve wondered about the advertising question as well, both in Group and YS’s case. I know Marko can’t speak for Group, and I’m sure not losing sleep over it, but I am a little curious.

  19. I haven’t read the Battle Cry books but I did take a group of kids to Acquire the Fire last year. The talk about how manipulative the world is through media and culture just got to me. I was bothered not because I disagree with that sentiment but because ATF’s use of media and their counter Christian culture, to me, mirrored their complaints about the techniques used by the secular world. On one hand, the world is trying to brainwash youth for evil and on the other hand BattleCry seemed to be brainwashing the youth for Jesus. I decided we needed to leave when Kayla said, “I want to go down there to pray because if I don’t that means I’m not a Christian, right?” I’m all for passion and I’m all for gathering youth together in quality events but as far as I’m concerned, the gospel can be shared without pyrotechnics. This idea of us being at war seems combative at the expense of love. I find myself wondering if there’s a kid struggling with homosexuality among the kids protesting in San Francisco. What does that message say to him or her?

    And a sidenote: At ATF one of the speakers told the girls in the audience that they ought to dress modestly. If they were unsure if an outfit was appropriate, they could ask their youth pastor’s wife and she could help them decide. As a female youth pastor without a wife I just shook my head. The joke with the kids for the next few weeks became “Go ask Sara’s wife.” I’m sure some churches are still divided on the issue of females in ministry, but I’m not and I’m not going to support an organization that relegates a female to a “wife of a youth pastor” role. This San Francisco stuff just gives me another reason to pass over Battle Cry materials.

  20. What does this communicate to the kids in our youth groups who are silently struggling with their sexual identity? Now instead of coming to us for help and healing, they feel criticized and rejected. They keep it to themselves and maybe later abandon Christianity altogether.

  21. Wow, this has certainly generated a whole lot of feelings on both sides of the fence! I for one have had no exposure to any of the ATF events, however most of my kids have and I have seen great things come from it.
    I agree that there needs to be a certain amount of “control” over the contenet of such an event, because of teh potential damage that could be done if not properly delivered. However, I do not agree that this is not a battle with culture. I truly believe that it is in fact a battle of culture. Todays culture is a breeding ground of Satanic proportions. There’s is way too much “sex, drugs and R&R” (if you will) thrown at our kids and ourselves today. And the driving force behind it says that we need to be more acceptable toward it. Diversity they call it.
    Sorry folks I’m not buying it.
    I say continue the battle, but temper the spirit with the word!

  22. I’m feeling ya Marko.
    Ron is staying true to his theological framework. It’s interesting (and frustrating) to look at from afar. The situation in San Fran is created by how Ron’s theology allows him to engage “the world”. The response to his “message” is instigated by Ron. Then when articles like this are written, or when people picket his event, he uses it as a reinforcement of his perspective and theology.

    As with any worldview that’s not our own it’s easy to pick apart. How Ron uses “The world” is naive, but pretty common in the church I think. the problem with Ron, is that his tactics and speeching are actually reinforcing the very gap between youth and teens he is “crying” against. Ron, doesn’t have a problem paying AT&T, various “secular” Universities, jobing.com, BankUnited and… are you kidding me Cox Communications (one of the countries largest CAble and Internet Service Providers)to use their buildings. “The world” is a nebulous term for all that is wrong and bad and… dare I say, not us. There are no lines you can draw. It’s way more messy than he lets on. But again, this is probably a theological issue.

    Other random thoughts.

    The battling for a generation is a fear based attempt at spreading the good news, which makes me wonder, if it is really good news.

    Passion without reflection leads to the very thing that Ron crys out against.

    When Ron motivates us by fear, he is using the exact same motivation that often contributes to the very behaviors and endevours of “the world” he attacks.

    The American Marketing Machine seems to be a big problem for him, but he seems pretty adept at jumping into this river with both feet. How many mailouts, videos, and phone calls can one organization send out? I guess it’s only bad to “brainwash” teens (his words)with marketing when it’s for Jesus.

    The heart of passion and emotion as Ron consistently demonstrates often has the same root. Passion which seeks behavior change without transformation of the heart is at best naive, and at worst, the worst kind of manipulation. There is nothing sustainable about manipulation.

    When you attend an event, the word, impulsive comes to mind. It seems to be interchangeable with passion. Teens are neurologically prone to impulsive decisions and this ministry takes advantage of that.

    Adultery. Revenge. Lust. These are also rooted in passion without depth and connected to fear.

    So if I could say something to Ron. Yes. There is a much to be afraid of. You are right on much of what you say. But without addressing the way you say it or the method you advocate for change and transformation, you are not only leading a majority of the people you lead into long term life change, you are doing exactly what “the world” you despise does, you’ve just given it a religious shell.

    or I could be completely wrong theologically.

    Also. Doubleing your youth ministry every year for the next several years.

  23. Thanks Paul for pointing out the very obvious that I missed.

    Jeff, Like Marko said it was just dialogue. I was just making statements that were open ended. Those statements were made to open up dialogue which is obviously what happened. My second comment was because at the time I felt the question wasn’t answered by Marko with the specifics as to how to gather that amount of teens without 1) incurring the wrath of the media that will feed the fire, 2) offend a segment of society that is entrenched in SF.

    I felt the ending questions were still relevant as this is supposed to be dialogue. It is interesting that you assume I have been hurt and went on to presume and judge my faith. One that you presume on me to not only be a sin but a crime. Very interesting Jeff…very interesting.

    Maybe to answer my own questions. It is obvious that teenmania should steer clear of San Francisco especially in light of last years fiasco. To go back was a slap in the face to the community especially with the intensity of the message they (Teen Mania) are bringing.

    In past years the message was not as radical and may not have been as offensive.

    Gathering at the courthouse is probably not a good idea as it will only bring on a fight. And yes Marko I do think that it only feeds a fire and does not show Christ in a true light. He has called us to be a light and salt. And we can truly do it in a better way than this.

    Teenmania should pay attention to the culture of a city and should adapt their methods.

    Interestingly as I am typing this out I saw the news highlights of the event at the courthouse. I guess I didn’t see the out and out hate by teen mania that everyone is claiming.

    Again should the theme and methods be changed sure. I also do agree with Dave, today’s teen culture is in a battle. And it is very infecting to teens not only who are not Christians but to those that are.

  24. sorry — you guys really do deserve a response on the questions about ys and atf and marketing and such. i haven’t had a spare minute. i’ll try to comment more at length tomorrow at some point.

  25. I sitting on the fence with this issue. I have been to a few of the ATF (Battlecry) events and have not personally liked them at all. I dislike the pushy advertising by Ron (“I’ve just finished a curriculum that will change your youth ministry and you must buy it now!). I don’t care for the war imagery, and I hate just sitting around. BUT, the lives of the kids I’ve brought have absolutely changed. My smalltown teens get to see what corporate worship for them really looks like. That’s why I continue to take them. And they don’t come back with a hate toward people not in our “club”. I think some of you are speaking very harshly about this without knowing what is really going on at these events. I’m sensing from some of you an attitude that you have all the answers on how God works in the lives of teens to the point where you’re say that God couldn’t possibly work in the lives of those that attend these events. – Sorry I started ranting there at the end. I’m just not impressed with the attitude by some of these comments. I agree to some extent with a lot of them, just don’t like the “tude”

  26. I was out Battle Cry at Philadelphia last spring and our group decided not to go back because it was more propaganda than Jesus. Students were encouraged to be “branded by God” (this years theme) yet every break was an opportunity to buy ATF shirts, books, mission trips, etc. We had to ask ourselves whether Ron wanted our kids branded by God or branded by Acquire the Fire. He spoke out against materialism, yet it was buy, buy, buy ATF stuff.

    Marko, you’re right, the video from the conference of the prayer on the City Hall steps @ San Fran was revolting to our group as well. We felt the whole event was adversarial. Which is why we will never go to another ATF/Ron Luce event.

  27. Jason – You are exactly correct, and I apologize. That statement of mine was very hypocritical (thank you for not actually saying so). I spoke in generalizations and in specifics, and was very unclear as to which was which. All in all, it was a very poor representation of my thoughts, and I humbly apologize.

    I do believe that there is a significant portion of the American church that is exclusive and elitist, one that requires conformity to an overly narrow and assumptive interpretation of scripture. I was reminded of this again last night in my adult small group. One of the group members is still haunted by an event that is over 40 years in the past, where she (being a Lutheran Church in America youth) was sprinkled as a child, and having a group of “friends” tell her she was going to hell because she wasn’t dunked. This attitude of judgment and conformity, this attitude that belies a belief in a selectivity of grace and requires conformity before even applying for grace is very hurtful to the catholic church and to individuals struggling to understand how to relate to God. From what I have observed, Ron Luce is the embodiment of that attitude.

    I don’t have the benefit of Marko’s personal contact, so I can’t speak to who Ron Luce is in person. What I do know is that the account of Marko’s personal contact with Ron Luce is the only time I have not, at a minimum, been saddened by what I have seen of him or of ATF or of BC. Usually I am not just saddened, but truly offended. I can’t help but feel that for every youth who is saved, for every person who straightens out their life because of ATF and BC, there are many more who will never consider Christ because of the hatred and forced conformity and exclusivity they perceive coming from these events. In the long run, I think they do much more harm than they do good.

  28. I am a youth director who is young enough to have attended an ATF event when I was a teen. What I remember taking away from it was a passion for mission, and, in the grand scheme of things, ATF was a very small part of my spiritual development as a teen.

    Like all things in the world, and in youth ministry for that matter, youth need to be provided with a frame of reference and encouraged to seek out answers with each other, alone, in scripture, with parents, etc.

    To condemn ATF (which I don’t think Marko is doing) or to claim that it’s the be all and end all and everyone who says otherwise is ignorant and part of the “enemy,” is contributing to an already large divide in the Christian community. I think one of the most important things for the future of us Christ-followers is to be unified in love. Love is way more important than opinions or culture or us and them. Maybe I’m minimizing or over-simplifying here, but in all my (very) imperfect attempts at doing youth ministry, the one thing that’s always gotten through and always succeeded is loving my kids. I think Ron Luce is trying to love too, though his methods (like all of ours) are flawed, and unfortunately, very public. I hope in all of our trying make our voices heard, we’re able to sit back and listen to the guy on the other side of the table, pray, cry, whatever, but love each other first and last.

    Thanks Marko for opening this up, and also for being an example of Christian love.

  29. I too took my group to Battle Cry Philly and will not take them back this year. (for the record, the trip was already planned before I took-over as Youth Pastor)I feel like there was a lot of hype and “ra-ra” but not much substance. I am not a fan of Ron Luce, per se, but I do believe that his heart is in the right place.

    I disagree with their approach and a lot of their tactics (why my group does not participate), but I think that it is having an influence.

    This brings me to a whole other subject though. Do you think, as youth pastors, directors, leaders, etc. that we place way to much stock in these packaged, hyped-up rallies? I have seen time and time again youth go to these rallies all hyped and pumped for about three weeks following the event, but eventually they fizzle out (of course we do the same thing, maybe, after a NYWC). I think that it’s tons more important for us to teach our students the importance of establishing and maintaining their personal walk with Jesus. I am not saying that rallies and the like are wrong, but we must be careful how much stock that we place on them. I am rambling, but those are just some thoughts that I have; what do you guys think?

  30. ray — i think big events still have a place, but not the place they used to have. they’re great for allowing students to realize that they are part of something bigger than themselves or their circle of a few friends. and they CAN BE good as “ebeneezers” — creating moment-in-time memories of a god-moment. but we can’t, as youth workers, put our weight on them like we used to, in terms of priority in the scope of our ministries.

  31. …as a Bay Area youth worker I shunned the event and felt that the name BattleCry was truly a stupid name choice. It could have only been more inappropriate if they had named it The Battlecry Crusade. I was walking around in the Tenderloin district late the other night wondering if it wouldn’t have been better to have brought 20,000 kids to the City to love the downtrodden in Jesus’ name. Mercy Cry.

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